We have been covering the paedophile scandal cover-up of Phil Pringle of C3 Church. If people tuned in to 2SM radio this morning, they would have learnt that this scandal also found it’s way into the Hillsong movement.
This morning, Grant Goldman from 2SM radio publicly challenged Scott Morrison’s associations with cult leader Brian Houston of Hillsong. Goldman also introduced the serious issues behind Hillsong by introducing cult leader Phil Pringle and his C3 movement into the mix, highlighting the fact that both men have covered up paedophilia in their church’s. Goldman focused on Kerrie Ferguson’s story as well.
You can read Kerrie Ferguson’s ongoing story here in how this was covered up:
Scott Morrison attends ShireLIVE and has close ties with the better-known Hillsong community. Brian Houston is one of Morrison’s mentors and we have a personal email claiming that Scott Morrison has boasted that his mentor is Brian Houston.
TRANSCRIPT: Grant Goldman to Scott Morrison, Monday 21 September 2015.
“On August 24th, less than a month ago, I had something to say about Scott Morrison, I stated that in 2007 Morrison as State Director of the Liberal Party was the beneficiary of a totally unfounded and unjustified smear campaign against a man by the name of Michael Towke, the telecommunications engineer who had been preselected by the Liberal Party for the seat of Cook. The effect of that smear campaign was that Morrison, who in contesting the preselection, had received less than one tenth of the votes won by Towke. But Morrison was able to gain the Liberal endorsement as the Member for Cook.
In recent days supporters of Tony Abbott have suspected the loyalty and sincerity of Scott Morrison who appears to have been rewarded for his failure to defend the then Prime Minister against the Turnbull attack. In his Maiden Speech to the Federal Parliament on 14 February 2008, Scott Morrison made favourable mention of Pastor Brian Houston who operates the Hillsong religious organisation.
So who is Pastor Brian Houston, the mentor to Scott Morrison? Is he?
This is the fellow who told a Royal Commission that he had no legal or moral obligation to the victims of sexual abuse perpetrated by his predecessor in the leadership of Hillsong, his father Frank Houston. In October 2014 the Royal Commission into Institutional Responses to Child Abuse was told by a witness known as AHA that when he was seven years only, Pastor Frank Houston would come to his room, lie on him, fondle him and masturbate him. When Brian Houston found out that in 1999 that his father was a pederast taking advantage of a young boy, he failed to tell the Police. Instead, Brian Houston and committee of the Assemblies of God suspended Frank Houston’s preaching credentials, for just two years.
It gets worse. I have in my hand as I write a copy of testimony given to the Royal Commission into Institutional Responses to Child Abuse by a lady named Kerri. I shall put this document on my website. Kerri told the commission the tragic story of how her son was raped by the man she had married. Her son reported the crime to two Pastors, Gary Dench and Ian Treacy. They did not tell the police. They did not tell the victim’s mother. They admonished the victim, telling him he was partly to blame.
After Kerri learned from her son what had happened, she told the Police and also asked for help from the Head Pastor of the Christian City Church, Phil Pringle who provided no assistance. Pringle had suspended Dench, not because Dench had concealed a crime against a child, but because Dench’s wife had won a prize in the lottery.
Later Kerri asked for help from Pastor Brian Houston of Hillsong Church knowing him to be a close friend of Pastor Phil Pringle. I’ll quote what Kerri told the commission:
“I related our circumstances to Brian Houston who became very irritated, told me he did not believe that such a thing had happened, turned his back on me and walked away.”
That is Brian Houston, who I understand with his wife Bobbie still calls the shots at Hillsong.
I am inviting Scott Morrison to come on my program and repudiate Pastor Brian Houston. I want Scott Morrison to express disgust at a Christian Leader who fails to report the sexual abuse of a child. I want Scott Morrison to express disgust at a Christian Leader who turns his back on member of his own congregation, a mother whose son has been betrayed by other pastors in the network, who refused to report to police that that boy had been raped, and instead told the boy he was partly to blame.
If you agree with me, back me up. If you disagree, prove me wrong.”
The bible symbolised sexual immorality, delusion, wickedness, blasphemy, abomination, impurity and hatred of Christ and his church through the image of a prostitute:
Then one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls came and said to me, “Come, I will show you the judgment of the great prostitute who is seated on many waters, with whom the kings of the earth have committed sexual immorality, and with the wine of whose sexual immorality the dwellers on earth have become drunk.” And he carried me away in the Spirit into a wilderness, and I saw a woman sitting on a scarlet beast that was full of blasphemous names, and it had seven heads and ten horns. The woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet, and adorned with gold and jewels and pearls, holding in her hand a golden cup full of abominations and the impurities of her sexual immorality. And on her forehead was written a name of mystery: “Babylon the great, mother of prostitutes and of earth’s abominations.” And I saw the woman, drunk with the blood of the saints, the blood of the martyrs of Jesus. When I saw her, I marveled greatly. Revelations 17:1-6
Today we have the apostate church marvelling at the holiness and righteousness of Kong Hee and his wife Sun Ho who have financially bled Christians dry through dishonest means to support their lucrative ministries.
In her music video clip below, Sun Ho is playing a prostitute in her song ‘China Wine’.
Sun Ho said about her China Wine album:
“I’m really excited about this album, because I feel like it really represents me even though it’s in English.”
“I want to work with the choreographer to come up with “China Wine” dance steps and stuff.”
“And I was dancing during “China Wine” in the studio, and he started dancing too. I’m really looking forward to how it will actually affect the audience[…]” [Source]
Kong Hee even defended his wife’s role as a prostitute in the Sun’s China Wine video clip. Not only does he defend her, Kong flaunted her his ‘China Wine’.
Still the men standing with Kong Hee and the six accused are not addressing the allegations of Kong Hee who is accused of mishandling church funds of up to US$20 million. Furthermore, these ‘pastors’ are not informing their congregations that the six accused also used another US$20 million to cover up the original US$20 million spent to finance Sun Ho’s music career.
These ‘pastors’ who are standing with Kong Hee include:
Brian Houston of the Hillsong Church Movement
Phil Pringle of the C3 Church movement
Convicted criminal David Yonggi CHo of Yoido Full Gospel Church
Jeffrey Rachmat from Jakarta Praise Community Church (Jakarta, Indonesia)
Mark Conner from City Life Church (Melbourne, Australia)
Paul Scanlon from LIFE Church (Bradford, UK)
Casey Treat from Christian Faith Center (Seattle, USA)
John Bevere from Messenger International (USA)
Ed Young Jr, of C3 Church (US)
Margaret Court of Victory Life Centre
At this year’s Presence Conference, Kong Hee did not preach about God. Instead Kong preached about his life and all his accomplishments. Not once did he inform anyone present the details of the investigations and the allegations made agasint him. After preaching a selfie, Phil Pringle deliberately went out of his way to conceal the facts of the investigations and Kong Hee’s court proceedings and encouraged people to give money for Kong’s lawyers.
Not only did they mislead the tens of thousands tuning in, it appears they also deceived Israel Houghton.
Is Lakewood now standing with Kong Hee in his trial?
The Grammy Award-winning Christian singer Israel Houghton has been the worship leader at Osteen’s Lakewood Church for the past thirteen years.
Recently, Houghton stood up at Phil Pringle’s C3 Presence conference and claimed that “they” were standing with Kong Hee and CHC as they face the trial.
“I know we’re not supposed to have favourites but those three people up there with their lights shining, they’re my favourite people right now. If you’ve got something that lights up just pull it out, c’mon. Let’s just do this. Lighting up the kingdom that cannot be shaken. We’re standing with Pastor Kong tonight and we’re standing with Singapore. We’re standing for City Harvest. We’re standing with everybody who’s fighting life through right now. And this is going to be a reminder that God is fighting for us. And He is pushing back the darkness. And He is lighting up the kingdom that cannot be shaken.”
Really Houghton? Would you light up the kingdom of God with Kong Hee’s wife at your next musical event?
We hope that Lakewood will investigate the serious nature of the CHC scandal and consider where they stand with Kong Hee and CHC. Do they know the charges that Kong Hee is facing? Is this the type of “Christianity” they wish to have associated with their name? Does Israel and Lakewood really want to stand with Kong Hee and CHC?
Does Lakewood want to lie in the same harlot-stained bed of CHC?
Is your Jesus INCLUSIVE? Do angels fly on your prayers? Are your prayers so powerful that they activate the energy of angels? Does YOUR worship have the power to write the story of your life? Did you know that your worship is outworking YOUR salvation story?
Do your prayers open heaven? Do your works trigger god to make your dreams come true? Did you know that the Kingdom of God is open for business to fulfill your dreams? Can you bring a part of heaven to earth? What if every day you could find a secret place that unlocked the power of heaven in your own life and in your home? With a mighty brush and an outstretched arm, do you believe Pringle can force the Holy Spirit to invade Sydney and his Presence Conference?
Well if you somehow think this nonsense has anything to do with Christianity, then the Presence Conference 2014 is perfect for you.
Recently, we have analysed the C3 brochure for Presence Conference 2014. In this brochure, C3 and its speakers invite you to worship a convoluted new age deity that seems to be more obsessed over your selfish desires. (There does not seem to be an emphasis on the crucified and risen Jesus.)
With all the talk of “igniting personal revival that builds the Kingdom of God” you should be excited! When Phil Pringle states that “the entire experience has been created with you in mind”, he REALLY has you in mind! He wants to shame you into worshiping so he can get your cash.
With Kong Hee hanging out in the Singaporean courts to see if he will be convicted or not, Giglio caught in the crossfire for compromising Christianity in his home country, Houston bumbling on Allah and the Christian God being the same God, why go to Phil Pringle’s Presence Conference? You’ll only find Phil’s three spotlight speakers provide entertaining ‘stuff’ that you will probably forget about in a week or two.
Here is Phil Pringle’s Presence Conference 2014 brochure. Can you imagine the Apostles advertising a Christian event like this?
Here is side 1. Click the image to see a bigger version of the brochure. We will provide the information on the relevant pages even though you can access this same information from the PresenceConference website.
THERE IS NOTHING THAT COMPARES TO THE PRESENCE OF GOD.
OUR HOPE for this conference is that you would experience an encounter with Jesus Christ and there would be an afterglow that remains long after the last session closes. A touch of Heaven that shines light into darkness, despair and discouragement. That Jesus would be lifted high and glorified and the message of inclusion, reconciliation and salvation – when love came down from Heaven with the gift of eternal life – brought to the ends of the earth.
OUR PRAYER is that we would worship together under an open Heaven and see things that we’ve always dreamed of but never believed could actually take place, and to people who never thought they could happen to them. And it will only happen when we join together and pray. God says “If you pray… I will hear in Heaven and heal the land… I will pour out my Spirit on all people”.
OUR INVITATION to you, is to do whatever you can to join us as we spend 4 nights and 3 days in the Presence of our magnificent God at the Sydney Entertainment Centre, igniting personal revival that builds the Kingdom of God. The entire experience has been created with you in mind and the schedule is specifically designed to give you time to breathe, with each session not starting till the afternoon so you can truly be refreshed! Also, our children and youth have their own tailored conferences – complete with praise, worship and international guest speakers – so while you encounter God so will they.
Here is side 2. Click the image to see a bigger version of the brochure.
Phil and Chris “The place of agreement is the place of power, the place of unity is the place of anointing, the place of fellowship is the place of salvation. Millions of angels are waiting for the Church to pray so they can fly in on the power of those prayers and through the spirit of worship activate their energy, raise their bows, bring forth swords, spread their wings and rescue people all over this city. Heaven meets earth.”
“I want you to know that today Heaven is open. Today God is alive. Today God is at work. Today God’s grace is enough and His reach is enough to take anybody from anywhere and bring them all the way to the place that He has always dreamed for them to be. There is enough mercy. There is enough power in God today – right now! Heaven is open people! And the Kingdom of God is open for business.”
“Heaven – the dwelling place of God; the residence of God; a place where His PRESENCE can be found. This is none other than the house of God, the gateway into heaven! Heaven meeting earth is found in the Church, in the gathering of believers. Jesus said in Matthew 18:20, ‘For where two or three are gathered together in My name, I am there in the midst of them’.”
Rev Canon J. John
“The Lord taught us to pray, ‘Your Kingdom come, your will be done on earth as in heaven’ and we know in heaven there is no pain and sickness and it is filled with the sacredness of God. My wife Killy and I are pumped up with anticipation and expectation to soak in His presence and discover His healing.”
“We worship a risen and reigning King, a powerful God and a personal Saviour. Salvation is God’s restorative work – and our worship is a partnership with God in that work. Worship has the power to write the story of your life. Just as your soul longs for God, so our worship is outworking our salvation story.”
PRESCHOOL AND PRIMARY AGED KIDS ARE IN FOR AN OUT-OF-THIS WORLD EXPERIENCE AT PRESENCE KIDS THAT WILL BECOME ONE
OF THE MOST MEMORABLE WEEKS OF THEIR YEAR! THERE IS NOT ONLY LOADS OF FUN, GAMES, ACTIVITIES, SHOWS, RIDES AND
THE CHANCE TO MAKE NEW FRIENDS ALL UNDER THE BIG TOP, BUT THE OPPORTUNITY TO SPEND TIME WITH GOD IN POWERFUL
WORSHIP! THIS YEAR WE ARE DISCOVERING THE PLACE WHERE HEAVEN MEETS EARTH AND HOW IT ALL BEGINS IN THE LIVES OF
OUR KIDS! IT IS GOING TO BE SPECTACULAR AND WE ARE SO EXCITED TO EMBARK ON A MARVELLOUS ADVENTURE TOGETHER!
THERE IS ANOTHER WORLD, A PLACE WHERE FEAR, SICKNESS AND SADNESS ARE NON EXISTENT, IT IS CALLED HEAVEN.
IT IS OUR FUTURE AND OUR FINAL HOME.
BUT WHAT IF WE COULD BRING A PART OF HEAVEN TO EARTH?
WHAT IF EVERY DAY WE COULD FIND A SECRET PLACE THAT UNLOCKED THE POWER OF HEAVEN IN OUR
OWN LIVES, IN OUR HOMES AND IN OUR SCHOOLS?
WHAT IF WE COULD BE COURAGEOUS, AND NOT FEARFUL, JOYFUL, AND NOT SAD?
WHAT IF WE COULD EXPERIENCE HEALING AND MIRACLES?
WHEN WE HAVE FAITH WE CAN ACCESS THE POWER OF HEAVEN, THE EXPERIENCE OF HEAVEN STARTS HERE.
PRESENCE YOUTH IS FOR THOUSANDS OF YOUTH AGED GRADE 6 — 12 AND YOUTH PASTORS FROM ACROSS THE GLOBE TO GATHER TOGETHER TO BE IGNITED IN THE PRESENCE OF GOD LIKE THERE IS NO TOMORROW! THIS YEAR, WE ARE WITHIN WALKING DISTANCE OF THE ENTERTAINMENT CENTRE AND TRANSFORMING THE VENUE INTO A PLACE OF ENCOUNTER FOR YOUNG PEOPLE WHERE ONLY THE HOLY SPIRIT IS CENTRESTAGE.
WITH RETURNING SPECIAL GUEST CHAD VEACH AND NEW VOICE LOUIE GIGLIO, PLUS THE PRESENCE YOUTH TEAM, OUR PRAYER IS THAT EACH YOUNG PERSON WOULD EXPERIENCE THE SIMPLICITY OF INTIMACY WITH GOD, THE DELIGHT OF BEING IMMERSED IN HIS PRESENCE AND THE EMPOWERMENT TO LEAVE THEIR MARK ON TODAY.
THAT EVERY SINGLE ONE WOULD BE EQUIPPED FOR THEIR FUTURE AND INSPIRED TO CARRY HIS POWER TO A WORLD IN NEED.
PRESENCE YOUTH REGISTRATION IS ONLY $69 AND THIS INCLUDES ENTRY INTO THE DEDICATED PRESENCE YOUTH SESSIONS AT OUR SECURE VENUE DURING THE DAY, SUPERVISION FROM OUR DEDICATED TEAM OF YOUTH LEADERS, WORSHIP, WORD, MINISTRY TIME, ACTIVITIES, GAMES, AS WELL AS ENTRY INTO THE PRESENCE NIGHT SESSIONS.
JOIN US AS WE SEE THE NAME OF JESUS CHRIST GLORIFIED. WE CAN’T WAIT TO SEE YOU THERE!
JESUS CHRIST IS THE SAME YESTERDAY AND TODAY AND FOREVER. HEBREWS 13.8
Pringle has often stated that God said He had given him the city of Sydney.
He felt a great presence of God coming on him, giving him a real peace about Sydney.
“I want you to come to Sydney…” Sydney…
He had come before but the timing had not been right. There had been more growing to be done, more seeking of God’s anointing over his life, more learning of the ways of God in his life.
And on the return from India it had grown, the plant now beginning to stand erect by itself, rooted deeply in the spiritual ground God had prepared for it in this man’s life.
“I have given you this city…”
Source: – John Barclay, Arise, 1987.
Well. God also said that he had given the city of Sydney to Brian Houston. They’ve both still got a long way to go.
However, Pringle’s draw card this year for his 2014 Global C3 Presence Conference was his good “friend” Brian Houston. We find it hard to understand their friendship since their is rivalry between the two leaders and their ministries.
For instance, Christians from both Hillsong and C3 have called Hillsong ‘Big Brother’ and C3 ‘Little Sister’. In the past, Houston’s leaders, associates and long-serving members have often labeled Pringle’s church the ‘slipstream ministry’. We thought this rivalry and petty issues were resolved between churches until Phil Pringle made this recent comment in C3 San Diego.
[NOTE: Phil Munsey is the brother of the notorious TBN prosperity pimp Steve Munsey. Pringle had Steve Munsey speak a few years ago at his Presence Conferences.]
Here is the transcript:
“No. I promise Pastor Phil Munsey I will not take longer than thirty three minutes, amen!
I’m so glad to have this man here! He’s a hero of mine. An absolute hero in the faith. No doubt about it.
And uh- he ah-he-he- him and I have some similar thing because he lives just down the road from Saddleback Church – and he’s had to live with- you know- a larger church in town.
I live in the same city as Hillsong and- you know, it drives me mad.
You know I like- I just die every time somebody mentions it- I’ve done- a bit- lived with that for twenty five years. But I’m kind-of a secure guy- I really don’t care- I’m quite happy about what we’re doing and where we’re going. But y-you gotta know what t-the living with that sort of thing does- you gotta understand this: somebody’s always got something bigger. If you play the who’s-got-the-bigger-one… game- er. [Audience laughs]
What are you laughing at? You’re a bunch of rascals here you know that? My God! That just- that just- that just did not land right. [Audience laughs]
I told these guys, “You know I preach sometimes like seven times. This is only my what? Fourth time? By the seventh time I am saying things that are ludicrous. I c- I don’t even know what I am saying.”
Source: Phil Pringle, “Find Your Flavor” // Phil Pringle // 03.16.14, Vimeo, http://vimeo.com/89512591, C3 Church San Diego, Uploaded Wednesday March 19, 2014 10:49 AM. (Accessed 22/03/2014.)
It looks as though the rivalry is still strong, Phil Pringle still lamenting in Houston’s shadow. The “who’s-got-the-bigger-one game”continues.
So what is happening? Why is there this this unusual ‘unity’ among rivals?
With our rise in C3 readership, the reports we get from C3 leadership and the rise of insults we get from behind the pulpit, we are wondering if this is having an effect on Presence Conference registration.
If the conference registration is low, we are wondering if C3 members are having issues with Phil Pringle’s dishonesty and silence over the scandals he is associated with. We know leaders who are unhappy with Pringle’s dishonesty over the Kong Hee scanda l(who is still speaking this year at Pringle’s conference), frustrated with his silence over the Yonggi Cho scandal and questioning his involvement with the C3 Asheville scandal.
Like we’ve said elsewhere, going by the tweets and instagram photos, Brian Houston and Phil Pringle seem to have bonded more closely from last November to now. So is Brian Houston simply speaking at C3 Presence Conference to do Pringle a favour because registration is low? In inviting Houston to speak at Presence Conference this year, is Pringle hoping that Houston will draw enough people to raise the numbers to pay for the use of the facilities?
“Steven Furtick’s financial empire was built with BLOOD MONEY — money earned twisting God’s Word, preaching false doctrine & deceiving people IN THE NAME OF JESUS.” – Chris Rosebrough, 23/10/2013.
Could the same be said of Phil Pringle of C3 Church and Brian Houston of Hillsong Church?
In the last few months, people have been hassling or giving us links to report on the lavish lifestyle of Phil and Chris Pringle, Senior Pastors and Founders of the C3 Church Movement. The Pringle’s recently purchased a $3.5 million house and had no problem flaunting their lifestyle on twitter or instagram.
It’s been reported in the past that Brian Houston and his wife Bobbie have property deals of up to $1.4 million and that they are tenants of waterfront properties at Bondi Beach and the Hawkesbury River that they sold to LMI. Not to mention, it was reported that Houston said his total salary was “just over $300 000″.
Just recently, Steven Furtick (close associate of Phil Pringle and Brian Houston), has come under scrutiny over his $1.7 million house and his CEO approach to church ministry. Before looking at some news articles, we thought it would be good to provide an article and some links from the Pajama Pages blog on this issue. After reading the Pajama Pages articles, we have media articles reporting on Furtick’s mansion. We hope these articles help you understand the nature of how mega churches like C3 and Hillsong run.
Pajama Pages reports,
The problem with businessmenpastors. A reader’s contribution
A comment in the Walt White article is impressively on point that I think it deserves to be read by people who may not have made it to the end of that article. PP reader, Josh, posted the following this afternoon:
The problem with Furtick isn’t that he’s rich, or even that he’s a rich pastor. The problem is that he’s rich because he’s a pastor. If professing Christian Steven Furtick started a successful bakery, retail store or construction company in 2006 that was incredibly successful, so much so that he could buy a $3 million home, few would criticize him for enjoying his earnings. In fact, the world and people in the church generally look favorably on successful Christian businessmen. No one questions how Truett Cathy spends his Chick-fil-a money, for example.
The problem is that Furtick and others got their money by turning the church into a business. Pastors like Furtick are obsessed with business leadership because they fashion themselves as the CEO and identify more with celebrity CEOs like Steve Jobs than with non-celebrity pastors. Decisions are made by the CEO to build the brand, to create a larger customer base, to increase the giving margin, and to expand into new opportunities. Church personnel decisions are made in the same way. Is the youth pastor growing the youth brand? Is the worship pastor stylish enough? While such decisions are constrained at some point by biblical considerations…they aren’t going to hire a guy who publicly rejects the Bible…the biblical standards of Titus 1 and 1 Timothy 3 aren’t really considerations.
This creates two problems, though. One, churches aren’t businesses and aren’t supposed to be run as such. There is nothing wrong with Macy’s developing a non-fraudulent pricing and promotional strategy designed to extricate consumers with as many spending dollars as possible. Macy’s should offer products and services designed to produce high margin income. But churches aren’t businesses. The pastor shouldn’t spend time developing (or, more likely, purchasing from consultants) “offering talks,” or message series, or coaching services, or conferences with a goal of increasing the church’s income. The church shouldn’t be selling books and t-shirts and lattes and Bibles or anything else. God’s house is not a house of merchandise!
So when the Furticks of the Christian world stand up and talk about money (and they talk about money a lot!) it sounds a lot like Macy’s running television commercials for their two-day After-Thanksgiving sale. When they preach on tithing (a subject on which Bible-believing Christians can easily disagree), it sounds self-serving because it is self-serving. Is it Furtick the preacher of God’s Word talking, or Furtick the CEO of Elevation Church, Inc. talking? Nothing has changed in two thousand years. A pastor cannot serve two masters.
The second problem is the conflict of interest between the company (the church) and the CEO (the pastor.) Former GM CEO Charles Wilson reportedly once claimed that “What’s good for GM is good for the country.” (A misquote, but that’s not the point here.) Celebrity CEO pastors seem to believe that what’s good for the Lead Pastor is good for the church. That’s why they freely write and promote books on the church’s time and bring in other celebrity CEO pastors to “teach” (with undisclosed and sizable speaking fees). Does Furtick invite Craig Groeshel to teach for $____ because Groeshel brought in Furtick to teach at Lifechurhc for $_____? No one knows because it’s all a big, big secret. Is the five-week sermon series on “Sun Stand Still Prayers” for the edification of the church, or to promote the CEO’s new book, which is conveniently for sale in the church bookstore. Building the CEO’s profile will help him sell books, increase his demand as a guest speaker, and feed his ego. But does it benefit the church? None of your business.
The clear conflict of interest is exacerbated by an utter lack of accountability. Sure, if Furtick gets caught sleeping with his cute personal assistant (which has happened in at least two smaller CEO-style churches I’m aware of), he couldn’t salvage his position. But no one from inside his inner circle is going to question his business dealings, his use of church time to work on and promote his books, his purchase of his own and friends’ books by the church, his speaking fee at churches with mutual relationships, or his promotional choice of message series. Anyone from the inside who did ask such impertinent questions would suddenly find themselves on the outs, and in a personality-driven organization, loss of access to the leader is a dire sanction. Outsiders in the media or blog may ask questions, but they won’t get answers. And the rank and file members will stay on and keep giving…
… Related Posts:
There is coming a massive attack on the Pentecostal/ Charismatic movement by a group of individuals that don’t believe in the power of the Holy Spirit today – these men do not believe in speaking in tongues or the gifts of the spirit – they think that because of excesses in the church that they have a right to write off the fastest growing sector of Christianity – over 800 million in the earth today – that would be as bad as writing Jesus off because of one of the 12 was Judas Iscariot – if these individuals just adopted Gamaliel’s advice of Acts 5:38-39 that would be fine however they have no fear of God and are in grave danger of blaspheming the Holy Ghost – they think that because the movement has had scandals that have been publicised that this gives them leeway to do what they are doing – however the only reason why it gets the attention is because these individuals are on TV – everywhere I travel I hear of scandals outside of the Pentecostal charismatic realm but these are never publicised because no one knows them – they are calling their exposé strange fire however you better have the alternative if you are going to criticise something as counterfeit you have to produce the real – or else you had better shut up! The only ones who have the right to bring correction are the ones inside the camp not outside!
All the standard charismatic arguments are summarized there: He says critics of modern charismatic claims are unspiritual people motivated only by rank unbelief. He insists the weight of sheer numbers validates the modern charismatic movement (yet the high percentage of scandalous frauds, philanderers, and false teachers spawned by the movement means nothing). He emphatically declares that those outside the movement are not entitled to criticize charismatic abuses. And of course he includes the killer argument: The critics are people who “have no fear of God and are in grave danger of blaspheming the Holy Ghost.”
In reality, those who tout false prophecies, obscene bodily gyrations, and drunken behavior as gifts of the Holy Spirit are the ones blaspheming Him. In fact, no one is more notorious for that than Rodney Howard-Browne himself. For him to decry blasphemy and pretend to know anything about the fear of God is the very height of arrogant irony.
If you think that sounds unduly harsh, watch this video of a typical Rodney Howard-Browne “ministry” binge:
In October 2013, John MacArthur will be putting on a conference called ‘Strange Fire’. This event will explore what the Bible says about the Holy Spirit and how that reflects the spirit presented within the charismatic movement.
The ‘Strange Fire’ conference page has this to say about the event,
The sons of Aaron…offered strange fire before the LORD…and fire came out from the presence of the LORD and consumed them.
The Lord calls His people to honor Him, to treat Him as holy. Leviticus 10 pictures the consequences of not doing so—of offering to Him strange fire.
For the last hundred years, the charismatic movement has been offering a strange fire of sorts to the third Person of the Godhead—the Holy Spirit. And evangelical churches have chosen to be silent or indifferent on the matter. This hasn’t served the church or the Spirit of the church with honor.
So what should be our response?
Strange Fire is a conference that will set forth what the Bible really says about the Holy Spirit, and how that squares with the charismatic movement. We’re going to address in a biblical, straightforward manner what many today see as a peripheral issue. On the contrary, your view of the Holy Spirit influences your relationship with God, your personal holiness, and your commitment to the church and evangelism.
We want you to join us for Strange Fire. It really is for everyone—especially if you’re working through these issues with a friend, your family, or your church. Space is limited, register today.
Strange Fire is a Truth Matters conference, sponsored by Grace to You.
C3 Church Watch has gathered a vast load of information that reveals why cult leader Phil Pringle is not fit to be an Advisory Pastor for CHC. However, now we wish to turn your attention to CHC’s Advisory Pastor AR Bernard. He too has close associations with Phil Pringle and C3 Church (and also Hillsong).
We strongly advise C3 Church, Hillsong and City Harvest Church to have nothing to do with A.R. Bernard. We do not know when or where this was recorded. However, ministers should think twice about their own integrity if they choose to associate with A.R. Bernard.
Any God-fearing Christian should be disgusted that AR Bernard calls deceitful scheming men that achieve his selfish purposes “God’s favour”. To use the story of Rahab the prostitute in Joshua 6 to justify his behaviour is not the way a Christian pastor should behave. Nor should he be promoting such immoral behaviour to his audience.
Pray that AR Bernard repents.
[Edit: Transcipt now added (20/04/2013)]
“Here’s a question that comes up – “Can you be totally honest and be successful in the marketplace? Can you be totally honest and yet be successful in the marketplace?”
Now of course people who don’t subscribe to the Lord, who don’t subscribe to our value system will say “No you can’t! You have to be involved in bribes, you have to be corrupt and involved in corruption. You have to pay “under the table”, (laughs). You have to be a crook in order to be successful in the marketplace.”
Now many can honestly say that this has, you have, you have experienced a question like this, an issue like this, since you’ve been in the marketplace. Oh! It would only happen in America? Oh, man! [Laughs]
Where’s there’s a conflict of values and you’re put in a situation where you have an opportunity for a deal, alright? But somewhere in the midst, they want you to lie.
Now this is a dilemma that I had to think about and I came across a story because my value is, that not that honesty is the best policy, honesty is the only policy! Because if you say it’s the best, it means you have a other choice. But when you say it’s the only policy, you don’t have a choice. You’re going to be honest all the time, alright? And because you value integrity, no matter what the price is, you’re going to be honest.
Now let me give you some real practical stuff that goes on in the marketplace. Let me give you a story.
There was a women named Rahab in the bible. You’ve heard of her? Alright, she was a prostitute and uh- she lived on the wall in Jericho. And God had promised that Israel, under the leadership of Joshua, would ultimately take Jericho. Jericho was nervous because they heard about the God of Israel and the incredible things He had done and His power and all that. So the king of Jericho was terrified. The people of Jericho were terrified. This prostitute heard about it.
So ah- Joshua sends two spies. Goes to the city to check out the condition of things and these two spies come to this house of this woman, (who was a prostitute), named Rahab. And- the presence of the spies immediately indicates that Israel is about to make a move on Jericho. And Rahab is concerned about her own safety so she looks to make a deal because she believes what she’s heard about this God of Israel- of the Israleites.
So she says, “Look, I’ve heard about what your God did to certain kings, how He crushed their kingdoms. Word has gotten around and I’m going to tell you, everybody is terrified.” So she makes a deal for her own safety. She says, “Look I want to make a deal with you. If I help you, will you look out for me when the assault takes place?” And they basically said, “Yeah, we’ll help you.”
So here’s what happens, interesting scenario, alright?
Word gets out that these two spies aaare there, so she takes them up to the roof and she hides them and then the men of Jericho, the military of Jericho, comes to her house and say “Look we heard that two men came to you and we want to know where they are.”
Now here’s the dilemma. Here’s the moral dilemma when I talk about integrity and honesty, alright?
Rahab says “Um, actually I don’t know where they are. In fact I- they came and then they went off in a certain direction”. And the military, the guys from Jericho said “Oh-” they believe her, alright OK? And they turn and went off looking for these two spies. But the whole time she had them hidden on her roof! Now here’s the problem! She lied! How do we reconcile a person lying and yet serving the efforts of God? That’s the dilemma.
I remember one principle that I heard and um- it- the principle was, ah- that no lie ever serves the kingdom of God. And I had to think that through and say “Well, wait a minute! That’s not true! There’s been quite a few lies through the bible”.
And then I started associating names. Mmmm- Abraham (laughs) the father of faith, who lied. So you know, listen, we’ve got to be honest as Christians, and when we read something in the bible, we can’t try to gloss it over and rearrange it. It is what it is, it says what it says. So here’s this woman in the service of God, she lies! Boldly lies! How do I reconcile that?
Well I had to reason this through and said, “Okay”.
Number one, the men, the spies as it appears okay, the spies maintain their integrity. And the person who lied okay, was a person on the outside who heard about this God YAHWEH but was not in relationship with this God YAHWEH. So she had certain values that were not the same as these individuals’ values that they got from Yahweh. And I thought about that and I realised that there are times, (and I’ve experienced this, and you will too), where in business transactions God actually used people who had different values and lower standards, to get His work done. Now let me say, whoa wait a minute! [Laughter] Come on!. Come on! Let’s be honest here, alright? I’ll give you two illustrations, OK?”
When we were bidding on this housing development and we bid again below a billion dollars, but our bid was accepted, everyone had their part to play. So we had a team, we had equity partners, we had development partners, we had the government and the community, with my responsibility to use my influence with government and community in order to make this deal go through.
So I remember when the equity partners were about to leave and they said to me, they said, “Reverend, we don’t think you should be in on this meeting”. [laughter] They said, “Because we’ve got to roll up our sleeves and go to work in order to get the underwriting that we’re gonna need for this project”. I said, “Well, what do you mean, I don’t need to be there?” They said, “You really don’t need to be there REVEREND (emphasis)” [More laughter]
So the lights went on, and I said “Ohhhhhhhhh, OK! I won’t be there!” [Laughter] So whatever went on in that meeting, I didn’t want to know about it, I didn’t want to be a part of it, BUT I KNEW THAT THERE WOULD BE THINGS GOING ON IN THAT MEETING THAT WERE INCONSISTENT WITH MY INTEGRITY AND MY STANDARDS [More laughter]. SO I ALLOWED MY PARTNERS TO PROTECT ME FROM WHAT THEY WERE ABOUT to engage in.
Now, what did they do? I don’t know. But when they came out of that meeting, we had the financing we needed. And I said “Hallelujah!” [More laughter]
Let me give you another illustration: when we were building- [Laughs] We were building our 11-1/2 acre campus. Now in New York City, concrete and steel construction, ah, has been for decades owned by one family (and I don’t say the Trump family). it was a family that spells its name like this [Laughter] You know a family I’m talking about? [More laughter].
They ownsteel, they own concrete, they own rubbish removal. Listen, across the board, nothing gets built without their involvement, OK?
So we were building in the late 90’s. There were also coalitions, and the coalitions and unions get involved in order to push work for their union members. So any project that’s going on, coalition leaders will come down and take a look at the project and ask, “Do you have any union labor here? Because if not, we’re going to shut this place down!” And they could.
Now what we did, instead of hiring a separate development company, we were the GC (General Contractor) on the project. So if anybody was gonna get upset, they were gonna to get upset with the church. And you just don’t attack the church. That’s number one!
So what we did was outsource it, to bring it in. So when we went to purchase steel, (in order to do the steelwork, alright), we had to deal with the company that happened to be a part of this family. So in sitting down and talking [Laughs], with the head of the company. He said, “Well, you know, our family does concrete. Our family does, you know, ah, fencing”. And they told me all the services provided by their family. I said, “But look, in order for me to do this project fairly, I have to bid it out.” They said, “Don’t worry. We will always come in with the best bid. So get anyone else that you want to bid on the project and I guarantee you, we’ll beat their bid”. [Laughter]
So [Laughs] we had two other bids and we had their bids and sure enough, for some reason, the other bidders said we can’t compete with that bid [Laughter].
I don’t know if they couldn’t compete with the bid or the family! [Laughter] So they disappeared and we only had this particular company to deal with. So they started the project and I found out that word spread about this particular company was handling our construction project. And as a result, for some reason, we had no union problems, we had no coalition problems, no community problems, no government problems. The project went pretty smooth! Uh!
So, on the land next to – we have 11-1/2 acres, we were developing 6-1/2 acres. And on the other side, there was, ah, a- like a backhoe, big construction machine left on the property. So I saw that and I noticed it, and I noticed it- you know- it was there. And I think, “OK. They were using it so they parked it there because they need it”.
But they never used that machine! It just sat there! So I said, “OK, maybe they’re going to use it for something after”. But throughout the whole project, that machine just sat on the property next door to the property we were developing. So finally I asked the question. I said, “You know, you guys have had that machine there for the past two years throughout the development of this project and ummm, you know, you never used it. I don’t understand.”
“Reverend, don’t worry about it, we just left it there”.
Well, I found out that that machine was a “marker” and that machine sitting there “marker” told everybody who would drive by, “don’t touch this project!” [Crowd: “Woooah!” Applause]
So the project was under the protection and development of this particular family. [Laughet] Got it?
So there are times as we engage with the marketplace, God brings people to us who are not of the same values and integrity, who end up accomplishing things on our behalf, without us having to compromise our own integrity. It doesn’t mean you go out looking for corrupt people to do your work [Laughter]. Don’t think that that’s what I’m saying [Laughter]. There’s a difference when God gives you favour and sends someone, as opposed to you calling up, “Oh, OK. Let me give you the most corrupt individual you can find” [Laughter] . No, because then you become an accessory to the fact, alright?
But you’ll find, and I’ve found, (as it’s the only way I can explain this), that there have been times when God has just given me favour and given me people to do for me what I could not do for myself, nor did I need to know [Laughs] how it was being done because God knows that I want to maintain my level of integrity and my service. Come on! Give God a good hand clap offering!
Now, Joseph experienced false accusation. Let me just say something to you about false accusations. Number one, sometimes what appears to be a demotion is actually a promotion. Sometimes what appears to be a demotion is actually a promotion. Sometimes God humbles us in order to exalt us!
And as I said to you, there is no biblical record that shows where Joseph was vindicated against this false accusation. But let me give you some principles that I’ve learned over the years because I’ve gone through false accusations about things and the Lord has told me, in one very critical situation, “Just hold your peace, just be quiet and I’ll take care if this”.
And I held my peace, my wife wanted to talk because my wife said, “Well, He told you that but He didn’t tell me that”. She wanted to talk but I said “No, no, no, no, no, you’re under my covering!” [Laughter]
Let me give you a principle that I’ve observed over thirty one years, OK? False accusation is the last stage before supernatural promotion.
Falseaccusation is the last stage before supernatural promotion. Now, which means that if the devil cannot attack your quality of service, if he cannot attack your integrity, then he’s got to make up a lie about you! And when he’s got to go that far, that is the last stage before promotion. So you shouldn’t get angry and upset. You should do exactly like Joseph. What do you do? Continue the quality of service and continue to walk in integrity.
Your name is attacked before you’re promoted. Your reputation is attacked before you’re promoted. And if you can stand the attack on your reputation because you’ve built the character that you need, then you’ll experience the next level of promotion.
“Well, that’s not fair! Why do I have to be attacked? [Laughs] Why do I have to go through false accusation to be promoted?” Because rememeber: we live life on levels, we arrive on stages, right? And as you move from one level of life to another, the INTIMACY of your relationships must change. So quite often, false accusations that come against you, purge your relationships because you discover who you real friends are.
And believe me, when you’re promoted, you’ll want to take your real friends with you, not the ones who pretend to be your friends. You really find out who your friends are.
Earlier I said to you that relationship is a network for life – relationship is a network for life. [Asks where he is on time schedule, takes time for break] – A.R. Bernard
The famous preacher Charles Haddon Spurgeon once said,
“A time will come when instead of shepherds feeding the sheep, the church will have clowns entertaining the goats.”
Do you think that a C3, CHC or Hillsong Pastor comes across more like an entertaining clown rather than a faithful shepherd? Chris Rosebrough from Fighting For the Faith wrote an exceptional article what the role of the pastor should be. Sadly, we do not know any C3 pastors or Hillsong Pastors who reflect the role of a proper biblical Christian pastor.
When you call these pastors out on their antics their responses are predictable and consistent and usually go something like this:
Church Attender: Hey pastor, why don’t you ever preach exegetical sermons? I feel like I’m not being fed here because your sermons usually only contain 3 or 4 verses taken out of context in order to teach some relevant life principle.
Pastor: Why are you so selfish? The church doesn’t exist for you. It’s not about you.
Church Attender: Hey pastor, why did you have the worship team begin our Easter service with AC/DC’s Highway to Hell rather than a song proclaiming Jesus’ victorious resurrection from the grave? AC/DC is worldly at best and satanic at worst and that blasphemous song should not be brought into God’s house.
Pastor: Why are you so selfish? The church doesn’t exist for you. It’s not about you. Church isn’t for the already convinced its for the not yet convinced.
Church Attender: Hey pastor, why are you preaching about movies rather than preaching God’s Word like 2 Tim 4:1-3 commands?
Pastor: Why are you so selfish? The church doesn’t exist for you. It’s not about you. Our church exists for people who are not yet believers.
Notice that each time the pastor answers using the standard seeker-driven talking point and doesn’t answer the question but makes a blanket claim that the church doesn’t exist for believers and therefore the person asking the question is guilty of selfishly believing that the church exists for them.
Anyone who’s been railroaded by these tactics knows that something is way off about these claims being made by seeker-driven pastors but don’t exactly know how to put their finger on the problem or know how to put it into words. This post will help you do that.
Notice that every time the word pastor has appeared, thus far, in this post that I’ve bolded it and underlined it. That is to help you spot the irony of the statements being made by seeker-driven pastorsand that irony will help you identify the underlying error in their tactics and methodologies.
Here’s the irony…No where in scripture does it say that the church exists for unbelievers. BUT, there are clear passages that state that pastors and elders are to serve the church. Therefore, it is ironic and foolish for a pastor, whose job is to serve the church to justify methods that don’t serve Christians by claiming that the church doesn’t exist for believers.
Here are the key passages that address this topic. We’ll begin by first looking at the passages that discuss spiritual gifts. The reason for this is that the ability to teach God’s word is a gift given by the Holy Spirit to certain people within the body of Christ.
The Purpose of Spiritual Gifts is to Build Up the Church Not The World
The Bible teaches that God, The Holy Spirit gives different gifts to different believers for the building up of the body of Christ (1 Corinthians 12:4–7). Teaching is one of the gifts that the Holy Spirit gives to pastors and this gift is to be used specifically for believers.
“(In saying, “He ascended,” what does it mean but that he had also descended into the lower regions, the earth? He who descended is the one who also ascended far above all the heavens, that he might fill all things.) And he gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the shepherds and teachers, to equip the saints for the work of ministry, for building up the body of Christ, until we all attain to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to mature manhood, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ,”
In clear and unambiguous language God states that shepherds (pastors) and teachers in the church exist to equip the saints (not unbelievers) and to build up the body of Christ (not the world). This is clear and irrefutable.
Those Who Have the Gift To Teach Are Commanded to Feed Christ’s Sheep by Teaching the Word of God
The duties of shepherds and teachers within the church are governed by the instructions given by Jesus Christ.
“When they had finished breakfast, Jesus said to Simon Peter, “Simon, son of John, do you love me more than these?” He said to him, “Yes, Lord; you know that I love you.” He said to him, “Feed my lambs.” He said to him a second time, “Simon, son of John, do you love me?” He said to him, “Yes, Lord; you know that I love you.” He said to him,“Tend my sheep.” He said to him the third time, “Simon, son of John, do you love me?” Peter was grieved because he said to him the third time, “Do you love me?” and he said to him, “Lord, you know everything; you know that I love you.” Jesus said to him, “Feed my sheep.” (John 21:15–17)
Notice that in this passage Jesus doesn’t tell Peter to entertain goats or dazzle the world. Instead, Christ soberly and firmly reinstates Peter after he’d denied Jesus three times. And Peter was reinstated into ministry and that ministry was to shepherd and feed Christ’s sheep. These commands by Jesus to Peter stuck with him his entire life. Peter himself would later exhort elders (pastors) with these words:
“So I exhort the elders among you, as a fellow elder and a witness of the sufferings of Christ, as well as a partaker in the glory that is going to be revealed: shepherd the flock of God that is among you, exercising oversight,not under compulsion, but willingly, as God would have you;not for shameful gain, but eagerly; not domineering over those in your charge, but being examples to the flock. And when the chief Shepherd appears, you will receive the unfading crown of glory.” (1 Peter 5:1–4)
This shepherding language is also use by the Apostle Paul when he addresses the elders of the Church of Ephesus. Here are Paul’s words of exhortation:
“Pay careful attention to yourselves and to all the flock, in which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of God, which he obtained with his own blood. I know that after my departure fierce wolves will come in among you, not sparing the flock; and from among your own selves will arise men speaking twisted things, to draw away the disciples after them.” (Acts 20:28–31)
It’s clear from these passages that pastors are not literal shepherds and that Christians are not literal sheep. All of these images are metaphors that help create a mental picture of the difficult and sacrificial work of pastors. So, when Jesus told Peter to “feed my sheep” what was Jesus referring to? What does a Pastor/Shepherd feed Christ’s sheep with?
The answer is simple, the Word of God, and two passages will suffice in demonstrating this fact:
“[Jesus] answered, Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that comes from the mouth of God.” (Matthew 4:4)
“But as for you, continue in what you have learned and have firmly believed, knowing from whom you learned it and how from childhood you have been acquainted with the sacred writings, which are able to make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, that the man of God may be complete, equipped for every good work.
I charge you in the presence of God and of Christ Jesus, who is to judge the living and the dead, and by his appearing and his kingdom: preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, and exhort, with complete patience and teaching. For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions, and will turn away from listening to the truth and wander off into myths.” (2 Timothy 3:14–4:4)
No commentary is needed for these verses because they clearly teach that God’s Word is ‘sheep food’ and that pastors are to be feeding the scriptures to Christ’s sheep.
The Bottom Line
The next time you hear a seeker-driven pastor attempt justify his shallow sermons and entertainment driven stunts by claiming that “the church doesn’t exist for believers”, kindly inform him that regardless of who the church exists for, his job exists to serve believers and Christ’s sheep and that if he won’t do his job that he’s rebelling against Jesus Christ Himself.
Source:Chris Rosebrough, For Whom Do Pastors Exist?, http://www.letterofmarque.us/2012/10/who-do-pastors-exist-for.html?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=for-whom-do-pastors-exist, 19/10/2012. (Accessed 23/02/2013.)
As you see, it is has been documented that Amway-speaking Pat Mesiti “was re-instated as a preacher on Sunday 19 February 2006 and serves God with a new awareness and humility”. In the below transcript, it is revealed that Brian Houston and Phil Pringle “are good friends” and that Phil Pringle has known Mesiti “forever”.
Was Mesiti’s Christian character restored? Hillsong and C3 seem to think so. Mesiti said that when he came out of this restoration process he believed, “in the message of prosperity more now than I ever did”. We shall look more into this “message of prosperity” that Mesiti got from this process from both Hillsong and C3.
Below is a transcript of Pat Mesiti’s restoration.
Pat Mesiti’s restoration
Monday 04 September, 2006 – 16:55 by Hill$ong Squad in Default
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Christian City Church, Oxford Falls
6pm service, Sunday February 19, 2006
(Phil Pringle) “I know a lot of you were not in this morning’s service…and I need your attention ….I need your full attention people…I need you to be looking this way ..and listening….thank you very much.
Because this morning I made an announcement …and in last night’s service..that I need to make again and .. it’s a great announcement …a very joyful announcement.
About four-and-a-half years ago …there was an evangelist in this country by the name of Pat Mesiti.
Most of you I think will know of him.. some of you may not.
He had a television program and was regularly conducting crusades … where through..500/1500 people would come to Christ.
He was an initiator of many great youth programs, including Youth Alive here in New South Wales… and accomplished a huge number of things for the nation ..in the realm of evangelism and.. touching people’s lives with the gospel.
However, four-and-a-half years ago, Pat had a terrible, terrible tumble….a moral collapse which resulted in his marriage breaking ..and ..was a sad moment.
He was taken out of ministry…and ..stepped down.
He was an ordained minister in the Assemblies of God ..and after attempting to retrace..recover ..and after a year…it seemed it wasn’t going quite how it was anticipated.
So Brian Houston and myself..who are good friends ….I said….look…I’ll put my hand up…I’d like to ..help…and I’ve known Pat ..forever and he’s good friends with a lot of the people on this staff …and has been…..and I thought this’d be great if he came..and was in our church…and we would seek to see him standing on his feet again.
A number of years ago…I said to the Lord….’I’m so busy being a pastor….I don’t feel like I’m being a Christian.’
And…that just meant I was so busy leading and preaching ..doing all the stuff I wanted… I felt like…going and handing out pizzas to the homeless in Hyde Park ..or visiting people in old folks’ homes or reading books…or people in prison.
I’ve done all that..and used to teach in a school for handicapped children ….and …I go and visit prisons …just tell them to send up a prisoner if they didn’t have a visitor ..and I’d be there….and they didn’t know me…so.. when you get to be a pastor…you get a lot of other things going on ..
But He said to me …’no you’ve got a church full of people who can do that’……so I pray you do it man…
And He said….’no..no..no..what I want you to do is reach out to people that other people can’t reach out to..and that’s pastors …who are having troubled times…
And so…I try to do that…and there’s a few …who…I have no judgements on men and women who’ve found their life in trouble ….
Who knows what pressures they’re facing and what things they’ve gone through …but I do know they need to be recovered and restored.
And there is a pathway for that…repentence …restoration…restitution ..and making things right.
So Pat came….and I said to him…’Pat ..I want you to do several things…..one….turn up to church..’
And even with the shame and the awkwardness and the emotional difficulty of all that …I said ..’that’s what you’ve gotta do’.
Because the church is the best place you can be…rather than a counselling room ….just being in the worship…being in the local church …being involved in some ministry …of serving in the House.. all of those things are the best healing processes you will ever find yourself engaged in….because you’re forced to modify your behaviour and get things right and overcome …and all kinds of things….and relate to people…
And then just the Spirit of God working amongst us..
I believe in the power of the local church …it is the most powerful thing on Earth …to actually affect all sorts of things in people’s lives.
So Pat did that..and one year after his marriage had broke…he met a lady called Andrea ..and I was happy to participate in their marriage …three….two-and-a-half years ago …two years ago? Two years ago ….and that was a really joyful occasion.
And Pat and Andrea served in the visitors’ lounge …helping us there …and have continued to be involved… in our church over that time.
And he’s been relating to Greg French….Simon McIntyre ..Mark Kelsey and myself …over that period of time.
We’ve had times where we’ve needed to say things…or help him understand things..or whatever ..and Pat has been exemplary in all his ways of handling it.
I have tried this with a number of ministers and leaders over the years ..and I’ve got to say not without a lot of success.
It’s been unfortunate..because people find it difficult ..find it tough to recover…old steps.
But Pat has really displayed a repentent attitude ..and a commitment to a pathway ..that will bring him fully back into that way…
And the ministry team…we’ve all talked to each other…..and quite satisfied that he has fulfilled all those obligations.
The Assemblies of God asked him to do three years of restoration……it’s actually been four-and-a-half years now…that he has been out of ministry…and …as I said…we are happy that…
….So in the 10 o’clock service this morning… we laid hands on Pat and Andrea…and restored them to the ministry that God has called them to…(applause)..
In those services……well..actually…only in the 10 o’clock service….I asked Pat just to share something briefly..and he did… and so…I said…I want you to share in that service just briefly…..but what I really want you to do is preach in our church on Sunday night….
So…I want you to welcome Pat Mesiti as he comes…” (applause/cheering/Mesiti hugs Pringle)
Phil Pringle has often tried to dis-associate himself from the prosperity movement. Many people see Phil Pringle and his C3 Movement to be of the Word of Faith and Prosperity movement.
However, Pentecostalism and Word of Faith/Prosperity Movement are two different things. Many in the Pentecostal movement have embraced the teachings in the Prosperity Movement. Ph.D Professor of Bible and Theology John Wyckoff defines Pentecostalism as follows,
“… the twentieth-century Pentecostal movement has succeeded in restoring the experiential dimension of the Spirit’s dynamic presence to a significant segment of the church. Pentecostals believe that recovery of the doctrine and experience of being baptized in the Holy Spirit is comparable to the Reformation’s recovery of the doctrine of justification by faith.”1
With this in mind, this article points out Phil Pringle is a prosperity teacher and that his movement is part of the prosperity movement.
‘Prosperity doctrine’, ‘positive confession theology’, ‘faith-formula theology’. These are some of the terms used to describe a relatively new system of theology that has emerged from the Word of Faith movement, also called the Faith movement or the Word movement, that began in the nineteenth century and after its rise in the twentieth century has reached wide-spread influence within the Pentecostal movement and beyond. Prosperity theology is also strongly associated with the Divine Healing movement.
Current proponents of this movement in America include Kenneth Hagin, Kenneth Copeland, Charles Capps and Frederick Price. Prosperity doctrine is based upon a belief in the unified power of faith and the tongue. Faith is a confession; faith speaks (“I believed, therefore I have spoken.”) Also, words spoken in faith come to pass. According to this view, we create reality, whether good or bad, with the words of our mouths. Fear is negative faith. It is confidence in the certainty of a negative outcome. ‘What I confess, I possess’ is the view sometimes referred to as ‘now faith.’
Accordingly, there is available for the Christian supernatural blessing for their complete prosperity. ‘Prosperity’ is broad, encompassing all of life, including blessing mentally, physically, financially and socially. And it is immediately available for all Christians who follow the ‘laws of prosperity’ outlined in God’s Word, the Bible. This view also stems from a belief that a Christian’s inward and spiritual transformation will naturally result in an outward working that takes effect in every area of life. God’s blessing for Christians who lay hold of it is victory and overcoming in every sphere.
Generosity is encouraged as a key to financial prosperity, however such giving must be faith-filled to have a positive effect. The essential law of prosperity is the power that resides in the spoken word which will always precede from faith. Prosperity leaders and teachers would urge, ‘don’t pray the problem; speak the solution.’ ‘If you honour God, he will honour you’, in your business, your body, your exams. God’s goal for every Christian is success and abundance in all its forms.
The logical endpoint of this doctrine is what some Pentecostals insist: God’s ultimate goal for Christians is constant health, wealth and happiness. Where they fail to achieve this divine healing is a matter of expectation. However, God’s desire for Christians is that they do not suffer at all. This teaching insists that it is never God’s will for physical disorder or discomfort for any of his children, ever. For them, suffering occurs for Christians because of personal sin, even involving a simple lack of faith in God’s will to protect them from harm.
In Australia the growth of the prosperity movement, particularly within Pentecostalism, is largely attributed to the influence of the movement in America. Key leaders within Australian Pentecostalism have embraced the prosperity message in recent times, such as Brian Houston, who wrote You need more money (1999), urging readers to discover God’s “amazing financial plan” for their lives. Phil Pringle, another Pentecostal leader who is a key proponent of the prosperity gospel, wrote Keys to Financial Excellence, explaining how Christians could achieve financial success and freedom for themselves through the Biblical principles of prosperity.
What are the origins of the Prosperity doctrine? How far do the roots of Positive Confession theology go back and how has the Word of Faith movement developed over time to result in the current emphasis on abundant and prosperous living within Pentecostalism? This will be the topic of articles coming up.
 John W. Wyckoff (Ph.D., Professor of Bible and Theology, Chair, Church Ministries Division at Southwestern Assemblies of God College), Systematic Theology, Chapter 13 “The Baptism in the Holy Spirit”, Logion Press, 1995, p. 454.