Tag Archives: Mark

Does All Scripture Point To Mark Kelsey And C3 Leaders?

28 Tuesday Feb 2012

Posted by in C3 Culture, C3 Ministry, C3 Spirituallity, C3 Teaching, C3 Values

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EXEGESIS, EISEGESIS & NARCIGESIS

When a pastor teaches the congregation, they are meant to use exegesis.

A basic definition of ‘exegesis‘ is a, ‘Critical explanation or interpretation of a text, esp. of scripture.’1

This is the correct way to handle scripture. However, eisegesis was a very popular method used by pastors to approach the scriptures.

A basic definition of ‘eisegesis‘ is a, ‘personal interpretation of a text (especially of the Bible) using your own ideas.’2

This is an incorrect way to handle scriptures.

A basic definition of ‘narcissism‘ is ‘Extreme selfishness, with a grandiose view of one’s own talents and a craving for admiration’.3

When you combine a narcisistic pastor using eisegetical methods you get Furt- a pastor who reads themselves into biblical passages. For example, they are to be a King David conquering giants. They are a Moses, leading the people. They are Solomon bringing the glory of God through their wisdom and expansion of the House of God. This is now becoming known as ‘narcigesis‘. No pastor should use the bible to exalt themselves.

ALL SCRIPTURE POINTS TO JESUS

Jesus said,

“You search the Scriptures because you think they give you eternal life. But the Scriptures point to me!” John 5:39

By reading ourselves into the text, we replace Christ with ourselves. To do this is to be antiChrist-like. John MacArthur says,

“The spirit of Antichrist has always been in the world. It has manifested itself both in open opposition to Christ and in subtle attempts to replace Christ.”4

The term Antichrist is explained in Vines Expository Dictionary,

“Antichrist: can mean either “against Christ” or “instead of Christ,” or perhaps, combining the two, “one who, assuming the guise of Christ, opposes Christ” (Westcott). The word is found only in John’s epistles”

This is what makes pastors, teachers or leaders who practice narcigesis dangerous. If pastors  are reading themselves or their audience into the biblical text, they are reinforcing the belief that scriptures point to themselves, “instead of Christ”. We have seen Phil Pringle also replace God the Father with himself and Jesus with money. See articles:

C3 Giving Sermon Transcript: Just Another Manic Sunday

“Let Me Just Talk To You Out Of A Scripture” – Pringle’s Use of John 3:16

To quote Pringle from the articles:

“When it says ‘God so loved the world’, we need to put ourselves in there and say, ‘I so love the world, that I will give the only begotten son’. And for us to actually achieve that, to spread the Word of God around the world; to plant churches, make disciples, empower saints, build bible colleges- all of it is done through your giving.”

And again:

“We will so love the world that we will give sacrificially”.

In other words, his narcigetical interpretation of the text is, “For I so loved the world that I gave my finances sacrificially.” He would not be that bold to say something so obviously wrong. However, that is what Pringle was essentially saying.

Scriptures say,

“… This is the antichrist, he who denies the Father and the Son.” 1 John 2:22

John 3:16 is a fantastic verse that teaches that the Father sent his Son so that we may believe in Him to have eternal life. Pringle denied this passage to speak alone on eternal life given to us by the Father and Son. He denied people access to the gospel. He denied people access to the Way of Salvation through the Father and Son. Instead he pointed a different direction to his congregation – self and money.

This is a good example why narcigesis is dangerous. Unfortunately, Executive Pastor Mark Kelsey took it one step further.

IF ONLY THIS WAS APRIL 1ST…

On the 1st of June 2011, Mark Kelsey spoke at the C3 Church Sydney Leaders Meeting.

“… And then Isaiah 61 sees Jesus walk into the temple. And goes, ‘Oo! Could be my day!’ He sees the scroll handed to the son of God. He sees him unfold it. He’s going, ‘Isaiah sixty one. Isaiah sixty – sixty one! One! One!”

And He, Jesus starts to read it. And He said, “Today this scripture’s fulfilled in your hearings.” Suddenly that scripture was fulfilled. You see, even Jesus found his identity in the word of God. Even Jesus- He didn’t go, “I’m the Messiah by the way. Did I tell you that? I am the Messiah.” He didn’t say that. He went to the scripture, found Himself in the word of God.

Where are you in the word of God? Where are you in it? Where are you in the word of God? Because THAT is what gets God on you. It’s not about knowing scripture, it’s about finding yourself IN the scripture. There’s the difference!” – Mark Kelsey, C3 Church Sydney Leaders Meeting June 1 2011, 19:19, http://vimeo.com/24594951, Uploaded Thu June 02, 2011.

At 10:49, Mark Kelsey says to C3 leaders about Christians in their bible studies (Connect Groups),

“They wont be impressed by what you know. They’ll be impressed by what’s on your life. That’s what touches people. That’s what feeds people. That’s what brings revival.” – Mark Kelsey, C3 Church Sydney Leaders Meeting June 1 2011, 19:19, http://vimeo.com/24594951, Uploaded Thu June 02, 2011.

WHY KELSEY SHOULDN’T USE MARKEGESIS

Remember what Jesus said?

“You search the Scriptures because you think they give you eternal life. But the Scriptures point to me!” John 5:39

Mark Kelsey above teaches C3 leaders that “it’s not about knowing scripture” but wants them to apply scripture in a way that makes other Christians ” impressed by what’s on [their] life”. He is using the scriptures for selfish gain. This directly opposes the declaration of Christ and should not be how any Christian minister should teach.

Finally, Mark tells the C3 leaders that other Christians “wont be impressed by what you know” and how “what’s on your life. That’s what touches people. That’s what feeds people. That’s what brings revival.” Really Mark? Are we God? Are you speaking from experience?

1. Who touches people’s lives IS the Spirit of God.

2. Who feeds people IS the Word of God.

3. Who brings revival IS God when we exalt Him by preaching repentance through the gospel.

4. And we are NOT Jesus who IS the Word of God.

IN CLOSING

What was just reinforced in the minds of C3 leaders was narcigesis: putting confidence in the flesh; throwing out the Word of God and BECOMING the Word of God (“It’s not about knowing scripture, it’s about finding yourself IN the scripture”). This is very troubling.

This is the very EXACT THING that Pastor Matt Chandler spoke against at Steve Furtick’s ‘Code Orange Revival’. This was the sermon that annoyed Steve Furtick which he afterwards sensored. Possibly due to critics, he uncensored Chandlers sermon. Read our articles about this here:

Phil Pringle Endorsing Problematic Steve Furtick for Presence Conference 2012

Chandlers sermon is well worth the watch:

In essence – the scriptures NEVER point to fallen, sinful creatures. They point mankind to God, Jesus Christ – the fulness of God in bodily form. We are in Jesus but we are not Jesus. We are made in His image but we are not God.

If you feel lead to pray for Mark Kelsey and the C3 movement, please do so.

______________________________

[1] Oxford American Large Print Dictionary, Oxford University Press, pg. 434.
[2] Wordnet, Princeton University, http://wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn?s=eisegesis, (Accessed 28/02/2012).
[3] Wordnet, Princeton University, http://wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn?s=narcissistic, (Accessed 28/02/2012).
[4] John MacArthur, Grace To You, Marks of a True Believer, http://www.gty.org/resources/study-guides/40-5145/Marks-of-a-True-Believer, (Accessed 28/02/2012).

C3 College Classes With Mark Kelsey: Invent Your Own Theology (Part 1)

11 Saturday Feb 2012

Posted by in C3 & Pringles Associations, C3 Culture, C3 Ministry, C3 Spirituallity, C3 Teaching, C3 Values

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Exec Pastor Mark Kelsey

C3 DOESN’T HAVE THEOLOGICAL/BIBLE COLLEGES

Solid theological churches with theologically trained ministers don’t generally need to have Bible Colleges with their churches. Qualified teachers should be able to educate the congregation to the best of their knowledge. Often a member can question ministers and ministers will be open for correction or will happily provide members with material to spiritually grow in. As a result, the congregation grows in the Wisdom of God.

Because C3 members generally can’t discuss in depth what is being taught on Sundays, the structures provide it’s members to discuss their teachings in their C3 bible study groups (aka Connect Groups).

Unfortunately, the content isn’t deep. C3 therefore encourages it’s members to go to their colleges to learn, if you have a passion to learn about God. However, it is important to establish that the C3 Colleges are NOT bible colleges or theological colleges. C3’s 1985 Ministry Training College Prospectus says on pg 2,

“We are not a “theological college” though we teach theology, nor even a “bible college” per se, but a ministry training college where students learn biblically how to be effective in the work force of Jesus.

You will learn how to pray, how to move in the anointing of the Holy Spirit, how to preach the word of God, how to set your faith loose, how to study the Bible and numerous other essential skills.”

View the pdf we have made here on the 1985 C3 MTC Prospectus:

Christian City Church Ministry Training College PROSPECTUS 1985

More articles will be written on this topic later.

THE EIGHTH DIMENSION

The above statement by C3 has proven to be true. Mark Kelsey is proof of this.

In the first term of 2007, I had to take a class called ‘Life In Ministry’.  School of Creative Art (SCA) students had to take this class with School of Ministry (SOM) students. Mark Kelsey, the Executive Pastor, was our lecturer. He demonstrated effectively that both Christian City Church Colleges were not theologically or biblically based colleges.

I disagreed with the course content since Mark Kelsey continually taught from this diagram for the majority of the lessons we had with him:

Where is this in the bible? The only thing I found biblical about this diagram was that in the world we need to get a revelation to get into the Kingdom of God.

While loosely applying very few verses in the bible, Mark Kelsey made this up. Each segment was called a ‘dimension’. The way you access the next ‘dimension’ was by crossing the ‘bridge’ to the next dimension, usually through works. It’s important to note that the way you progress up the pyramid to the visionary status of the head C3 Pastor Phil Pringle, is through works of commitment, submission, discipline, responsibility and authority.

Mark Kelsey also drew a snake under the diagram at one point to teach that offense can make us fall back a dimension or take us back to the beginning again. It looked as though he was teaching an Amway scheme of ‘Snakes and Ladders’.

I didn’t want to do the assessment that was in relation to this and tried to protest my way out of doing something so stupid. Some students actually discussed the peculiarity of this subject, discussing the theology and practicality of it. They were confused. Some SCA students inquired how this was biblical in class, (not the SOM students). Unfortunately, none of us found that we could approach C3 College staff to address this peculiar teaching. Since the majority of the students were under 25, none felt they could actually object the class content and the assessment we had to complete in relation to the diagram

I found the entire approach Mark Kelsey was teaching about ministry was unbiblical, religious and pointless. As a result, I purposely went out of my way to mock the assessment. I was shocked to receive an ‘A’ for my efforts.

C3 College Class Assessment

I purposely went out of my way to be proud and not humble. I exalted myself of being prophetic, counselor-like, leadership material.

To get an ‘A’ for an assessment I treated as a joke reveals Mark Kelsey’s lack of competency and understanding as a minister, pastor or teacher of God’s Word and His Church. A thorough examination and training in the letters to Timothy of the bible would have been much more beneficial to students. Instead – Mark Kelsey made up his own theology and had us submit to his teachings.

THE EIGHT CORRECTIONS

The issues with the Amway-like diagram results in people and God favouring those who are in the upper class dimensions. Scriptures teach us that we are all on the same level playing field. While God does delegate certain people for certain roles, gifts and offices, God uses all of us and has no favourites (As C3 members say, ‘God is no respecter of persons’). All Christians:

1. … still sin. (1 John 1:8)

2. … are part of Christs church, therefore included as part of the Kingdom of God. (Matthew 16:19 – Read Gills Commentary on this.) (Mark Kelsey taught we are not of the church until we chose to commit ourselves to the church).

3. … are to be humble servants like Christ and be “with humility of mind” regarding others “as more important than” ourselves (Philippians 2:3-8).

4. … are to submit to one another. (Ephesians 5:21)

5. … are to minister to God’s people and those in the world. (2 Corinthians 5:18, Galatians 6:2, Ephesians 4:29, Romans 12:10)

6. … are called to be responsible. (1 Corinthians 7, Hebrews 4:13, Colossians 3:23, )

7. … are committed to the cause and vision of Christ. (Colossians 2:8, 2 Corinthians 5:18, Hebrews 3:12, 1John 5:20, 1 John 1:2, 1 John 5:5, 1 John 5:13, 2Peter 3:9, Romans 16:27)

8. … are under the authority and pledge loyal integrity to Christ. (Ephesians 5:24, Ephesians 1:22, Ephesians 5:21, 1Peter 1:7-9, 1Peter 3:14-17, Romans 16:27, Jude 1:25, Colossians 3:13, 1 John 3:16)

Hebrews 4 addresses that all people in the church are to grow together in fulness, maturity and unity in Christ. The gifts of God are there to help bring the church to the standard of Christ.

It is disturbing that Mark Kelsey calls students up on their loyalty to gain positions and titles within a church-like structure. Cults will often call people to pledge their loyalty to their leaders and movements. Integrity is the quality of being honest and having strong moral principles and moral uprightness. Integrity is greater then loyalty.

Mark Kelsey seems to disagree with the scriptures by forcing students to submit to his made up diagrams that supposedly look biblical. Then again. He is fulfilling the C3 College mandate that they are neither a “theological college” or “bible college”. We will see another sample of C3 College inventing their own theology in another article similar to this.